[SGVLUG] You can't have your cake and eat it too... (was: Energy content of human labor...)

[David Lawyer]

On Wed, Aug 29, 2007 at 09:25:39AM -0700, Emerson, Tom (*IC) wrote:
> > -----Original Message----- Of David Lawyer
> > > [...]
> > > > The only export from this community is ethanol 
> 
> [and]
> 
> > No.  There is "production" of all kinds of services one finds 
> > in a city.  Medical services, entertainment services, [...]
> 
> So, which is it?
Both.  Ethanol is exported but the production of services is all
locally consumed in the community (not exported) by the production
workers, service workers, spouses, children, retirees, parasites,
thieves, and others that live in the town.

> 
>   --> "only export is [corn] ethanol" [cake]
>  or
>   --> "production of all kinds of services one finds in a city" [a
> pretty decent meal...]
> 
> [my argument, based on your definition and re-iteration of the model]
>  
> > > After all, the "only export" [allowed] from this
> > > community is corn ethanol, so any activity that leads to the 
> > > production of ANYTHING other than corn ethanol would have to be 
> > > considered "waste".
> 
> If you're going to model and MEASURE the energy flow "to support
> activity 'x'", you need to consider that "activity 'x'" isn't the only
> thing going on, and [ultimately] it may be /impossible/ to separate out
> "energy spent on 'x'" vs. "energy spent on 'x', 'y', 'z', 'p', 'd', and
> 'q'".  If you DO consider energy spent on other aspects of life /as part
> of/ the energy spent on activity 'x', you WILL be overstating this
> value, perhaps drastically so...

Look at the fenced community.  The only energy flow out of the
community is x.  Thus for the community not to be parasitic, it must
have energy inflows less than x.  Thus the inflow of energy from the
point of view of the outside world is the energy used to produce the
only export x.  So the energy spent on y, z, p, d, and q (all
supported by inflow energy) all must be somehow "needed" to support
the outflow of x.

Sure, you can postulate an ideal community where there are no thieves,
parasites, and perhaps a bare minimum of art, entertainment, music,
etc.  But that's not the real world.  But still, it's of interest to
also estimate the energy cost of labor by assuming an ideal community.  

			David Lawyer